In case you haven’t been following the Audi saga, I made two posts about Audi and the Audi brand, and it pissed a few people off.
1 - Getting blasted on the Audi S8
2 - The problem with Audi
I got attacked, and I thought it was maybe a PR firm or something. It was just some very loyal Audi fans from AudiWorld.com. The comments from these folks are a little vulgar and childish, but worth a chuckle nonetheless.
Donkey farts, Morons and Bull#$%& Galore
“No offense to Russell, but his comments are less meaningful than a donkey farting through the wheat fields.” - Daniel
My thoughts: But what if those farts separate the wheat from the chaff?
“Obviously, the author of this article knows very little about automotive marketing. Just plain stupidity, nothing more can be said…a real moron.” - Rick
My thoughts: Marketing is marketing. It’s people selling to people. Consumer behavior. Marketers who think the magic is in the product (in this case cars) don’t know what they are talking about. Build what people want and what people feel good about and they’ll pay a premium for it. Some brands command a premium and some don’t. Hey, a least they called me “the author.”
“i advice you not to ever comment on any car related issues, not just Audi’s, given your limited and deceptive knowledge.” - Audi Fan
My thoughts: I’ll quit writing about cars when I quit driving. I drove an Audi S4 and was unimpressed. No curb appeal. I liked the Mercedes e55 WAY better. To be fair, I haven’t driven an S8 yet, but I don’t personally know anyone who would buy one either. Maybe I’ll change my mind about it when I drive one . . .
“honestly, who the hell are you to comment on what price range an Audi should be, If you dont like it, go buy a BMW or mercedes, keep your thrash talk inside of your head instead of your website.” - Audi Fan
My thoughts: I’m Russell, a guy who comments on what price range he thinks an Audi fits in. Did you miss that whole part about price and brand? When college kids can no longer buy an Audi while working part time the brand might change. Until then . . .
P.S. Did you forget? It’s my website. I write about brands all the time. I don’t believe Audi quite has the name of BMW or Mercedes . . . yet, and it certainly doesn’t carry the “prestige” of names like Maserati, Ferrari or Aston Martin.
“this is about the stupidest most biased most ridiculous article I have ever read about Audi. Unjustified, bull$$%& galore, I wish to meet the editor and smack his face.” - Audi Fan
My thoughts: I love being called “the editor” or “the author.” It makes me feel . . . important. One thing I have learned for sure is Audi fans are more like soccer hooligans. Audi hooligans.
“This is the most idiotic thing I have read in a long time…” - Alex
He, he he. Think what it would be like if I based on Apple at the same time.
What I’ve Learned
- Audi has some very, very, very dedicated buyers.
- The Audi S8 will likely sell better than I thought it would.
- It’s still an Audi. (Enter hate mail).
15 comments ↓
I hope these Audi folks are as half passionate about their wives/husbands as they are their Audis.
Labeling the people responding to your posts as “Audi hooligans” only adds to their disdain for your opinions. And I think that is really the source of their animosity, that you are posting what really sounds like a personal opinion rather than a professional analysis of branding strategy that takes into account sales data and/or projections.
Your observation that Audi has “very very dedicated buyers” makes no sense to me; it is as if you are not aware of what internet forums are like at all. If you blogged about how bad Mercedes Benz cars are and then linked to it on MBWorld.org, what kind of response do you think you would get, especially as someone who doesn’t *own* a Mercedes Benz and would be viewed as an outsider?
Saying things like “It’s still an Audi” is only inflammatory, and makes it seem like all you are really doing is trolling for more flame wars. It’s as if you were one of those really annoying people who do nothing on http://www.autospies.com but post things that will make the Lexus/Mercedes Benz/Audi/BMW-lovers scream at each other.
When it comes down to a question of whether or not the S8 was a mistake, I think it is very simple. Does the car make the company money, or not? The Phaeton was most obviously a mistake, as it did not make the company money, it most assuredly lost VAG a lot of money. The S8 should have an easier time of it as development costs were shared with the A8 and the Lamborghini Gallardo. It’s competition is the BMW 750i/760i, the Maserati Quattroporte, and the AMG-modified S class Mercedes Benzes. Out of these, only the 750i is perhaps cheaper than the S8, which is approximately $105k. So, will it sell? Time will tell, but it is sold out in major cities at a volume equivalent to what Maserati sells in Quattroportes in the U.S.
So, until you (or your company) makes a revenue of $40 billion a year and posts year-over-year sales increases eleven years in a row, perhaps you should do a bit more research into Audi before posting whatever pops into your head.
BTW, I can give you at least three more topics regarding branding/marketing cars that make more sense:
1) What was VAG thinking when they made the Bugatti Veyron as it does nothing but lose money?
2) What is Ford thinking renaming the 500 “Taurus”?
3) What does LVMH gain from purchasing Aston Martin?
You can send me the “royalties” from all the hits you get from those topics directly to my PayPal account. kthx
You don\’t think VW took into account sales data and/or projections before it launched the Phaeton?
Sales data/projections have nothing to do with perception of a brand. If you take the time to go back and read my original post you will see that I don\’t understand why companies spend so much money on sales data and projections and then make a huge decision on that data when it doesn\’t make sense to go with the decision in the first place. Companies thrive on data and throw common sense into the wind all the time because common sense isn\’t measurable.
Not one person from AudiWorld is getting this. It isn\’t about sales data, quality or whether I even like Audi\’s or don\’t like Audi\’s, it\’s about a mid-luxury brand trying to command high-end luxury pricing. If Audi ditched some of it\’s low-end cars and stuck with the high end cars, it would eventually ditch the mid-luxury perception. Audi should come up with a new name for cars over 80k or so. They\’d sell more. They\’d build a bigger presence, greater demand and a better presence. Toyota gets this idea. Most car companies don\’t. Toyota will be number one before long.
I thought Toyota was already number 1?
“You don\’t think VW took into account sales data and/or projections before it launched the Phaeton?”
No, actually I don’t… by all accounts the Phaeton was a pet project of upper level VAG management. In fact, didn’t someone get fired over just saying he thought the car was a bad idea in the first place?
“it\’s about a mid-luxury brand trying to command high-end luxury pricing. If Audi ditched some of it\’s low-end cars and stuck with the high end cars, it would eventually ditch the mid-luxury perception.”
This statement does not make any sense. What exactly are the low-end cars Audi is selling? The A3? If we were to follow your argument, Mercedes should dump the C series and stop allowing their cars to be used as taxis in Europe, BMW should stop selling the 1 and 3 series cars, and Porsche should dump the Boxster. The low end cars in a company do not define its image. These cars do not prevent Mercedes from selling a $400k SLR, BMW from selling a $110k 760Li, or Porsche from selling the $450k Carrera GT. And, most importantly, it hasn’t prevented Audi from selling out of the *not even on the road yet* R8 at who knows what price ($110-130k) for the next YEAR. This is why you seem to be talking out of an orifice that is not your mouth to us “hooligans”.
honestly, mr russell. You are the typical ignorant american that Audi is unfortunately trying hard to change. It has been plaqued by its past image in North america ever since the 60 min Fiasco.
Audi handily beats BMW or mercedes in China/ germany and many other parts of the world. North america however, different story.
I dont know where on earth you got the fact that Audi was ever a mid luxury segement. It produces some of the finest interior, legendary built quality and timeless design. i understand your right as labeling me as a hooligan. Fair enough, i can classify your post as the same too.
you must be enjoying the stupid publicity out of ignorant, unjust statements. Heck i dont give two hoots if you care whether the S4 has curb appeal. Thats all the better. Audi is the automoative world’s best kept secret, and it does not need fools to comment on its image when millions already know but do not brag about it.
Russ:
This is funny. The Eurotrash across the pond are really pissed off at you. Audi’s aren’t as good as these clowns are making them out to be. “Audi fan” states that Audi has the “finest interior”. Frankly, I find German styling to be a little too mechanical. I prefer Japanese styling over German styling. Don’t forget too that the Audi’s are mechanical nightmares. They always have been. I like your take on this and I agree with you.
Isn’t it amazing and so very surprising how different people have different opions and preceptions if brands?
Just got back from a trip to Denmark, where I amfrom. There MB is for “old” people, BMW is a “Brian” car (not sure I can translate - but kind of hick), and Audi is for “sophisticated”/”Quality” oriented people (quoting my danish brother-in-law). Prices for Audis tend to be higher than for comparable BMWs, whereas here in the US it is just the opposite. Happend to see an A8 W12 there, which lists around $130k in the US, and 3X (three times!) that in Denmark due to taxes. Go to Geneva in Switcherland, and you will see 5 A8s for every BMW or Mercedes (quarttor helps!) - of course the Swiss don’t know quality when they see it (couldn’t helpt that). We also saw a Lexus SC430 - my brother law couldn’t believe anyone would spend money on a no-name car like that!!!
Russel - You are reflecting the old US perception of Audi. I myself own an 03 S8 (they have been around since 01). Buying used Audis, I have been lucky to benefit from the higher than normal depreciation off Audis here in the US. Unfortunately the new models have some of the best residuals, so I am afraid the feast is ower. The nice thing is that Audi is now starting to bring over the top models we never saw before, such as the RS model - they have been around forever in Europe.
Yes - we are passionate from Audiworld. We constatly have the Audi/BWM?MB discussions going on. However, I must say that I think you are deadwrong on the S8 disappering and Audi not on its way to establish itself here in the US on an equal footing with BMW and MB (and in the process catering to different affluent groups).
Chris, You really have no clue. I work on all vehicle types, German and Japanese. I regularly pull down dashes and panels to install the latest Multimedia equipment and electronic systems. Trust me when I tell you this: Japanese cars cannot be compared in the same sentence as a German car when it comes to quality interiors. The metal and plastics used in Hondas/Toyotas (and yes Acuras and Lexus vehicles) are made of stamped cheap metal that is so sharp, it will slice your wrists. The plastic has to be removed with incredible amounts of care to avoid a crack. German cars use thick metal and the wiring is bound up in thick nylon wrapped looms that are placed like art. The plastics are thick and textured and are much heavier than the inexpensive plastics that are common on Japanese vehicles. Also regarding reliability, Audi is the one German company that is taking it seriously. Get your facts straight, because Mercedes is struggling in this area in a big way:
http://www.time.com/time/globalbusiness/article/0,9171,1115672,00.html Of course if you listen to the manufacturer, there are no problems:
http://blogs.edmunds.com/Straightline/1822
Henrik
“Just got back from a trip to Denmark, where I amfrom. There MB is for “old” people, BMW is a “Brian” car (not sure I can translate - but kind of hick), and Audi is for “sophisticated”/”Quality” oriented people (quoting my danish brother-in-law).”
One thing to remember the in different cultures hold things in greater or lesser respect. Case and point: in Brazil Halls cough drops are candy, they think the music group Roxette is God’s gift to music, and in England, if I not mistaken, the Mini Cooper is considered a Pinto whereas in the U.S. it is in very high demand.
@”jeff”
Blah.
Russ,
Looks like you stirred up a bit of a hornet’s nest. To me, it seems that the Audi Fans, like John Edwards, are getting a very hands-on and in-your-face education about Web 2.0, consumer-generated media. My concern is that neither one is learning the lesson.
I always find it interesting when people/readers attack you by calling you a “moron” because you disagree with them or express an opinion that doesn’t quite match up with theirs. This is not an uncommon human reaction, once we have exhausted the emotional and logical arguments, we tend to rely on character attacks–is it the right way to handle a situation? I don’t think so.
“To me, it seems that the Audi Fans, like John Edwards, are getting a very hands-on and in-your-face education about Web 2.0, consumer-generated media.”
Except that your blog page, and Russ’s, get about 10 hits a day, while AudiWorld gets hundreds of THOUSANDS. Whoop-de-do for you.
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